I’m not going to discuss the many psychological theories for rape fantasies. What I am going to do is explain why analyzing them in certain ways is problematic. David Ley, a regular writer at AVFM recently wrote about rape fantasies and his reasons for why they occur. What resulted was a comment section of men, misogynist men, normalizing rape as an evolutionary strategy. It reminds me of the adage about tools. You can use a hammer to build wonderful things but you can also use that hammer to hurt people. MRA’s hurt people.
MRA’s shouldn’t go near this topic because inevitably they display their utter contempt for women. Judgybitch even got in on this and said that she can’t dream about having sex with Ben Affleck because it’s cheating so she fantasizes that he rapes her. This is the most childish shit I’ve ever read. I think she says things like this to impress the guys, to let them know she’s ok with being treated as a doormat and that her entire existence revolves around male power. What woman hasn’t fantasized about sex with others even when in a committed relationship? Some of us do but we don’t consider it cheating.
MRA’s are now talking about how women are naturally submissive and if women fantasize about masochism the poor males get blamed for it. This is the problem with putting a hammer in their hands. They’ll either find a way to become the victims or they’ll make up biological theories that place women as inferior.
They also talked about the ‘old’ definition of rape which hasn’t changed at all. Most of them complained about having to obtain consent not realizing that consent IS the crux on which the crime depends.
‘Men are by nature, the dominant sex. The feminists deny reality for equality because it’s a way of coping with their feelings, that’s why they think a mere fantasy is symptom of some terrible patriarchal boogeyman. It goes well with the leftist belief that everything is socialized, and therefore changeable.’~ W.Gao
These abnormal men then try to naturalize rape fantasies by endorsing Elliot Rodger’s ideas:
‘Ive personally seen wealthy respectable women drop their panties in a new york minute when soda comes around bullying the F*&k ……..out of everyone that steps in his path!!!’
The idea that women only sleep with men who are violent and crude was the nucleus around which Elliot Rodger’s entire rage-filled manifesto revolved. The idea that women ruin the world by only sleeping with bad men is a common theme to MRA’s. Stefan Molyneux actually blames all the world’s problems on women who sleep with ‘assholes.’
Then there’s the idea that women are the oppressors of men because we ‘gatekeep’ sex. This idea is straight out of the Warren Farrell playbook and it does show MRA’s as men who are incompetent in having any kind of relationship with a woman, be it sexual or otherwise.
‘Generally speaking, the sexual dynamics between male and female is about the female having the power and control. As Tom Golden said, it’s the competer and chooser situation, where men compete against each other in the hope of getting chosen by women. This gives women the power of making sex a commodity they can supply as sparingly as they wish. Male-on-female rape is breaking this rule where the supplier has this commodity taken by someone she does not approve, and rape fantasy, to my mind, is the imagined loss of this control and power, by exercising control and power within her mind.’
This mental twisting into female blame is precisely what MRA’s do so well. You really have to be careful what ideas you allow them to play with but it does demonstrate their woman hatred and their inability to handle mature topics.
I think rape fantasies in women might be due to the fact that we are the gender that actually gets raped and threatened with rape. It might be a way to cope with the inevitable. We know as women that men, all men, have the potential to rape us within our structurally unequal society. It may be a way for women to control the inevitable rape, the rape that happens to many many women in peacetime and as a weapon of war. Rape is committed by men we know, men we trust.
Men don’t seem interested in stopping rape as a practice of oppression. Instead, they use the phenomenon of the female rape fantasy as a backdrop to normalize rape. David Ley suggested that these fantasies are coping mechanisms that show that women aren’t truly devastated after being violated. He thinks we should eliminate the disease model around rape and rape fantasies. He thinks that therapists and community organizations actually make rape worse by explaining how horrific it is. This circular reasoning is common in men because they don’t have to worry the way women do.
This is the typical male stance that normalizes rape as something women don’t really have a hard time with. Men preach that rape truly isn’t that bad because I think it makes them feel absolved of any responsibility in stopping it. If men can normalize rape as something that naturally happens they have no reason to want to end it. Ladies, how many times have you heard a man say that rape is an evolutionary way of continuing the species? If I had a dollar for. . .
Rape works for all men to keep all women in a state of fear. The fact that MRA’s normalize it and accuse women of lying about it means they don’t take it seriously, and why would they? Dean Esmay claims our culture is full of rape hysteria and that women are just worried too much. I should point out to the inept Dean Esmay that this fear is valid. The more men normalize rape into an inconsequential act they have no intention of stopping, women will remain afraid.
When only half the human race cares about a problem the other half commits without any sign of stopping it’s not unusual to be afraid.
Men can stop rape. If they want to.
Mancheeze 
They WISH women were having rape fantasies. THEY are the ones having the rape fantasies.
Trigger Warning: Comment is about rape, types rapists, and sexual “rape” fantasies.
Whenever I see men (mainly MRA’s) talking about the fact that “women have rape fantasies”….they always seem disturbingly giddy. It’s like the idea that women might fantasize about something like that, somehow absolves THEM (the men) for having fantasies themselves, where they are the “rapist”.
This topic always pisses me off and makes me extremely uncomfortable.
Many people that attempt to discuss this topic, or justify the fact they have rape fantasies, or try and use this type of discussion as “proof” that women “enjoy/deserve/want” to be raped……they all have no bloody idea what they are talking about, at all.
Rape is *hardly ever* about sex. It is about control, power, degradation, domination, etc. Men that resort to rape often feel inferior, emasculated, have low self-esteem, etc. It is a violent physical assault that is ACTED OUT SEXUALLY, but that doesn’t mean the primary motivation is because he was “horny” or was “deprived of sex”.
There are many different TYPES of rapists. Each one has their own unique characteristics/motivations.
Power Reassurance Rapist- The “gentleman rapist”, a man that feels inadequate around women. This type of rapist forces women to say “I Love You” or “I Want You” during the attack. This type of man likes to pretend he is concerned for his victim during the attack, and after the attack will do things like send her flowers, love notes, or even visit her.
Exploitive Rapist- Relies on domination/control, will be forcible, aggressive, and use threats during an attack. Macho, chauvinistic, “man’s man” type of person. Usually his attacks are ‘spur of the moment’. He is often married or lives with a female, and is likely to experience erectile dysfunction due to drug/alcohol abuse.
Anger Rapist- Feels anger/rage towards his victims, holds grudges or hates women. Will often use profanity around women, referring to them as sluts, bitches, or whores. This type of rapist wants to punish his victim by degrading or humiliating her severely. This type of man is likely to rape in fits of rage, and so it is hard to predict when he will do it. Very sexually aggressive during a rape, and will urinate, defecate, and forcibly sodomize his victim.
The Sadistic Rapist- Very developed fantasies, watch a lot of BDSM pornography, highly aroused by women being physically damaged, humiliated, or in pain. He is likely to stare into his victims eyes while torching/attacking her. Often these rapists force their victim to roleplay out HIS sexual fantasies during the attack. Will most likely take pictures or video tape the assault to use for stimulation later on. Very likely to kill his victims.
Date Rapist- Often uses drugs/alcohol during the rape. Often high school or college aged males, and often attacks occur on college campuses. Often this type of man may use the date rape drugs Rohypnol on his victims.
Not all rapists are the same, and each one will perform differently during attack, ranging from acting somewhat “loving” to brutally traumatizing and/or killing the victim.
These MRA’s need to get it through their thick skulls, that EVEN IF women on this planet have “rape fantasies”, that does not under any circumstances mean that she ACTUALLY wants to be raped in real life. And I hard doubt that these women that DO have rape fantasies are really, truly having serious fantasies about rape. I think they probably are having fantasies more comparable to dominating, aggressive sex.
I seriously doubt women are sitting in bed fantasizing about how some dude is physically attacking her, using a knife, cuts her face up, screams death threats and profanity at her, and sexually terrorizes/tortures her. Women that have these so called “fantasies” need to stop calling them fucking “rape” fantasies because that’s not what they are. They’re not truly thinking about becoming permanently traumatized, disfigured, or murdered.
There are a variety of reasons women might have these ‘fantasies’, but it is certainly not because she wants it to actually happen to her. Often women with these fantasies have been raped in real life, and use these fantasies as a way to re-live the experience in a controlled environment, giving her a sense of control over what happened to her. OR, the thought of being completely ‘irresistible’ to any man that he simply has to take her by force, is what is appealing to her.
Women aren’t turned on by socially maladjusted, emasculated rapist men.
“Whenever I see men (mainly MRA’s) talking about the fact that “women have rape fantasies”….they always seem disturbingly giddy. It’s like the idea that women might fantasize about something like that, somehow absolves THEM (the men) for having fantasies themselves, where they are the “rapist”.”
Right on!
It really sucks that there are still some people like this out there, but I think there is hope for feminists to combat this.
http://www.slate.com/articles/double_x/doublex/2014/04/male_rape_in_america_a_new_study_reveals_that_men_are_sexually_assaulted.html
This article is interesting because if the claims in the article are valid then rape is becoming less of a feminist’s problem and more of a men’s problem too. The article would then be saying that feminism worked and rape against women is no longer as common as it was before. Also, if it is true then that means that men’s right activists will have to actually focus on helping male rape victims instead of supporting rape apologists.
I’m a little iffy about the article though. It’s terrible if it’s true. I do know one male victim of sexual assault but his rapist was a man. Can you affirm the legitimacy of the article for me, MHQ?
I don’t know how legit it is. I don’t think it’s driving rape of women down either. AVFM linked to it.
The CDC has just put out a report current to 2011 on U.S. sexual violence. The summary is very cogent and well worth reading. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss6308a1.htm?s_cid=ss6308a1_e#Table1
I hope it’s ok to post the Abstract of the Report here: (EDITED FOR LENGTH-)
Abstract
Problem/Condition: Sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence are public health problems known to have a negative impact on millions of persons in the United States each year, not only by way of immediate harm but also through negative long-term health impacts. Before implementation of the National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence Survey (NISVS) in 2010, the most recent detailed national data on the public health burden from these forms of violence were obtained from the National Violence against Women Survey conducted during 1995–1996.
This report examines sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence victimization using data from 2011. The report describes the overall prevalence of sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence victimization; racial/ethnic variation in prevalence; how types of perpetrators vary by violence type; and the age at which victimization typically begins. For intimate partner violence, the report also examines a range of negative impacts experienced as a result of victimization, including the need for services.
Reporting Period: January–December, 2011.
Description of System: NISVS is a national random-digit–dial telephone survey of the noninstitutionalized English- and Spanish-speaking U.S. population aged ≥18 years. NISVS gathers data on experiences of sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence among adult women and men in the United States by using a dual-frame sampling strategy that includes both landline and cellular telephones. The survey was conducted in 50 states and the District of Columbia; in 2011, the second year of NISVS data collection, 12,727 interviews were completed, and 1,428 interviews were partially completed.
Results: In the United States, an estimated 19.3% of women and 1.7% of men have been raped during their lifetimes; an estimated 1.6% of women reported that they were raped in the 12 months preceding the survey. The case count for men reporting rape in the preceding 12 months was too small to produce a statistically reliable prevalence estimate.
An estimated 15.2% of women and 5.7% of men have been a victim of stalking during their lifetimes. An estimated 4.2% of women and 2.1% of men were stalked in the 12 months preceding the survey.
The lifetime and 12-month prevalences of rape by an intimate partner for women were an estimated 8.8% and 0.8%, respectively; an estimated 0.5% of men experienced rape by an intimate partner during their lifetimes, although the case count for men reporting rape by an intimate partner in the preceding 12 months was too small to produce a statistically reliable prevalence estimate.
Finally, among victims of contact sexual violence, physical violence, or stalking by an intimate partner, an estimated 71.1% of women and 58.2% of men first experienced these or other forms of intimate partner violence before age 25 years (23.2% of female victims and 14.1% of male victims before age 18 years).
Interpretation: A substantial proportion of U.S. female and male adults have experienced some form of sexual violence, stalking, or intimate partner violence at least once during their lifetimes, and the sex of perpetrators varied by the specific form of violence examined. In addition, a substantial number of U.S. adults experienced sexual violence, stalking, or intimate partner violence during the 12 months preceding the 2011 survey. Consistent with previous studies, the overall pattern of results suggest that women, in particular, are heavily impacted over their lifetime. However, the results also indicate that many men experience sexual violence, stalking, and, in particular, physical violence by an intimate partner. Because of the broad range of short- and long-term consequences known to be associated with these forms of violence, the public health burden of sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence is substantial. Results suggest that these forms of violence frequently are experienced at an early age because a majority of victims experienced their first victimization before age 25 years, with a substantial proportion experiencing victimization in childhood or adolescence.
Public Health Action: Because a substantial proportion of sexual violence, stalking, and intimate partner violence is experienced at a young age, primary prevention of these forms of violence must begin early. Prevention efforts should take into consideration that female sexual violence and stalking victimization is perpetrated predominately by men and that a substantial proportion of male sexual violence and stalking victimization (including rape, unwanted sexual contact, noncontact unwanted sexual experiences, and stalking) also is perpetrated by men.
CDC seeks to prevent these forms of violence with strategies that address known risk factors for perpetration and by changing social norms and behaviors by using bystander and other prevention strategies.
Thank you. You confirmed my suspicions.