The Western Women’s Burqa

There’s a viral video by Hollaback about male street harassment of women making the rounds. A woman recorded 10 hours of walking in NYC. Watch it first.

Hollaback describes street harassment:

The real motive of street harassment is intimidation. To make its target scared or uncomfortable, and to make the harasser feel powerful.

I’ve been street harassed many, many times. When I first started experiencing men harassing me in public it frightened me. It made me want to become small, invisible. I remember wishing I was taller so my walking strides would be larger and I could move away faster. When men would order me to smile I sometimes did it, all to avoid male violence. It was just like wearing a metaphorical burqa where men controlled my movement in public space, everything from what I wore to how I walked to where I’d go.

I think that street harassment is the epitome of male entitlement. The threat of male violence is why women don’t holla back. We don’t want to be called ‘cunts’ and ‘bitches’ for not responding to a male who thinks he’s entitled to our time. We don’t want to be violated any further.

As a woman you’re damned if you do and damned if you don’t.

Many men are reacting to the video with mansplanations about women ‘loving the attention.’ This is how males justify their entitlement. It’s a strawwoman.

MRA’s particularly are condemning the video. I’ve always maintained that if women want a good look at how regular men think then look no further than to MRA’s because they’re just more open about male privilege and entitlement.

MRA’s would have you believe that male street harassment of women is just men being human. In this video by Red Pill Philosophy he explains that it’s just about saying ‘hello.’

If you listen carefully he disproves his own assertion. He only says ‘hi’ to women he finds attractive. I suppose women he doesn’t find attractive just aren’t human deserving of a hello? He also uses the excuse that women are begging for it if they dress a certain way.

Men who street harass are predators. Also, if it was just about being ‘nice’ then men wouldn’t verbally/sexually degrade women for not answering back. It’s a trap.

If a woman does answer she’s immediately considered a slut and if she doesn’t she’s a bitch. Either way she’s put into a mental burqa that’s meant to control her.

Christopher Cantwell from the misogynist hate site AVFM explains:

What this is about, just like most feminist garbage being peddled, is giving women the power to have men arrested for anything without any evidence at all. That they’re mere discomfort is a criminal offense that should justify the kidnapping of men doing exactly what men are supposed to do: pursue women.

He admits this harms women and makes us uncomfortable. Men know it and do it anyway because it’s yet another way to control women, to force us to attend to them like they’re children.

In patriarchy women cannot be allowed to go about their day without random men controlling their behaviour. That’s why women don’t go out when they don’t have to. The public space is still not safe for women.

Cantwell stresses that women should get revenge.

next time you see me walking down the street: Ask me for my phone number. Offer me sex. Tell me I have nice mantits. Verbally express your admiration for my distended belly. Ask me to show you my package. I’m not saying I’ll do it, but I’m not going to call the police, lobby Congress to have you imprisoned, or advocate violence against you in any way.

I don’t think this is revenge. Revenge would be scratching your eyes out of your sockets and kicking you so hard in the balls that you can’t ever have children. In fact, since you don’t ‘get’ this how ’bout I make it easy? Say women carry around .38’s and if a man hollers at them we kill them. That’s revenge.

When men complain that women see all men as potential predators why don’t they see street harassment as a cause? Quite frankly, I don’t think men care. I’ve never experienced a man admonishing another for screaming at me on the street. Never.

There was a great story done by one of the major networks about male street harassers.They filmed men who regularly engaged in street harassment of women and wondered if the men got any dates from doing this. They didn’t, which gives us another clue as to the motivations of men.

Cantwell also gave us a clue. He said it’s about pursuit but that’s just another word for hunting, for predation. While this predation yields no results men still engage in it. Why?

Hollaback says that street harassment is very costly to women.

The long-term impacts include depression, anxiety, and post-traumatic stress disorder, as well as a reduced sense of safety that can limit earnings, decrease mobility, and interrupt their ability to fully engage with civic life.

The research paper Hollaback presents explains that men don’t understand what sexual harassment is because they’re the dominant group with privilege. This privilege makes them blissfully ignorant. What’s interesting is that men do express worry over how their words and actions might be viewed by women but because of male privilege they label their harassment as normal.

The paper agrees with me that this is about control and power. It also points out that men typically use violence in relationships because of their tendency to hierarchical organization where they place women below them.

By sharing power with women, men believe that they are giving women the power to control them.

That one quote provides a clear picture of patriarchy, toxic masculinity, and explains why men form backlash male supremacists groups like the MRM. Ultimately, men need to be re-socialized out of seeing relationships as hierarchies and their need to exert power over others.

The more control you exert over others, the more of a man you are according to traditional masculinity.

So what can we do about it?

Hollaback’s first attempts at getting women to holla back at the men were found to be ineffective. Now they work on educating young men to encourage a cultural shift in how men view women. To me this is really about ending patriarchal domination of women.

We have a lot of work to do.

Currently, in our liberal feminist culture everything becomes an individual effort. Hollaback states that each woman must choose how she’s going to deal with street harassment. While I think there’s immense value in making individual choices we must understand that we live in a collective where male violence affects all women.

The problem with seeing this as an individual choice is that it masks the harms that are done to women as a class. It means any choice is the right one. If a woman wants to sell her body in prostitution we accept it instead of analyze the societal structures that surround that ‘choice.’ We fail to name problems holistically and accurately. That’s why we’ve failed to enact the kind of change we want.

Things like pornography, with its inherent male violence against women, suddenly become what individuals do instead of what males do to women as a whole. In essence we ultimately say it’s ok for women to wear metaphorical burqas because it’s a sacred choice without understanding why women are doing this and how men are forcing it.

We make excuses for individuals is ultimately what it comes down to. One person’s behaviour doesn’t represent anything because it’s never seen in its wider context. Men who street harass are simply individuals with individual problems and not part of the wider culture of male entitlement that encourages and reinforces male violence against women.

Street harassment signifies the larger cultural problem of patriarchy where women are subjugated and controlled by men as a class, not as individuals. The bigger solution involves recognizing the male hierarchy of capitalism, the need to enact power over others, the construction of masculinity.

We need to teach boys a new ‘normal’ that doesn’t involve the need to control others.

Systemic oppression needs to be named and not hidden by simply calling it a ‘choice’ that some men make.

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85 thoughts on “The Western Women’s Burqa

    • I have no idea wtf wordpress is up to. There is a few words I’ve put in the ‘do not publish’ list but I always get a notice to approve the comment, and I do.

      I’ve gotten no comments in moderation from you at all. Weird.

  1. Okay, I don’t know what is going on, but I am completely unable to post that comment. I’ve tried three times. Other comments – like this one! – seem to go through, but the other one just won’t go.

    No, idea why! 😦

  2. The jist of the statement, which I’ve tried to post about 7 or 8 times now in different ways and even different wording is this:

    Yelling back at male aggressors doesn’t work. Some men have tried to turn the video into a race issue to deflect attention from the fact that all kinds of men harass and threaten all kinds of women on the street. And, I agree with your revenge, but I have very specific ideas about what it would be that will not, apparently, be allowed to be posted here by the WP system.

  3. This quote is 100% on the money:

    “The long-term impacts include depression, anxiety, and post-traumatic stress disorder, as well as a reduced sense of safety that can limit earnings, decrease mobility, and interrupt their ability to fully engage with civic life.”

    To paraphrase Andrea Dworkin in one of her speeches about the damages of porn: Ask yourself, what would women’s revenge look like?

    • My revenge is a revolution.

      MRA’s put us in a position to find reversal’s they can understand but in reality, they know street harassment is wrong. Finding reversals is just a way we waste time instead of dealing with patriarchy.

      Street harassment is a microcosm of how women are busy doing other things, getting over obstacles that men purposely put in our way so we don’t spend much time dismantling the system of oppression.

      I have many forms of revenge, none of which involve soliticing men for sex on the street.

      I’d like a city, nay a country, for women where we can walk freely, live freely without men demanding attention from us as if they’re little children who can’t get through the day without harming women.

  4. SNL did a skit in the 70s….Gilda Radner, et al., and they were dressed as construction workers during lunch. As the men walked by, they all jumped up and started cat calling them. I’ve tried to find it for years and can’t. But, it was perfect. Absolutely perfect. Men just don’t get this and they don’t seem like they ever will.

  5. HMQ,

    I’m reading that hollaback research paper right now. I thought I should let you know that there is an error in the address of the hyperlink. It looks like WP tried to help you out by providing the “http://” but it got put at the end of the address. If you just delete it, it works fine. So, the address is right – except for the junk at the end which is causing it to go to a 404 Not Found page.

  6. I’m not done reading the research paper yet, but I have to say I disagree that men don’t understand what they’re doing to women. They understand it very well and when we’re being threatened and sometimes assaulted by strange men on the street we know it, too.

    I appreciate what the author is trying to accomplish, but I think it’s futile. Men want to hurt women. They say they believe it is their right to do this, that it is part of their nature. I see no grounds for arguing against that because I believe this is, in fact, what they believe and my experience tells me the same.

    I, also, really disagree with the opening statement when it says that most men do not harass women. It depends on where in the country you live, in my experience, also street harassment is generally worse than harassment and stalking in an automobile – although this can be really bad and very frightening, also. So, if you’re walking to work, you’re in more danger. (For instance, there was that woman abducted walking home from work in Philadelphia a few days ago and the cops released some surveillance footage of her abduction. Probably that was some dude who was watching her come home at about the same time each workday. And, this is always a risk for women who must adhere to any kind of routine. Probably she had no idea she had a stalker because you usually don’t know until it’s too late.) In my experience, especially in NYC, most men DO street harass. Some of them will harass you from their cars, which we didn’t see in the video.

    I would say a majority of men harass or rape at some point – if not on the street, they harass and assault women at our workplaces and in our homes. Other men are complicit because they know (duh!) that most of them do it.

  7. I’m at P. 9 of the document. The researcher seems sympathetic to men who fear that they might be falsely accused of sexual harassment for simply behaving as they normally do in social situations. I’m paraphrasing.

    Men’s fears of false accusations are so much man-tear B.S. Men should try to imagine being falsely accused of being a whores from the time they are 12-years old. They should imagine being falsely accused of sexually coming onto men or being dressed “provocatively” when they’re wearing a pair of jeans or some other ordinary article of clothing. They should imagine being accused of being a slut for f**king decades on end!

    I have absolutely no sympathy for men who fear being falsely accused of something “sexual” by girls or women. Falsely accusing women of sex things is ALL men do. This is, in fact, the ROOT of the problem we’re talking about here. Women are always asking for “it.” It’s what we see in the video and it’s what I heard in that second video you posted by that degenerate Red Pillow Feller.

  8. Now, I’m on P. 21 of the document. It’s talking about power. It says at the top of the section that sexual harassment is about power and not sex, then goes on to describe how men and women perceive power differently. What it fails to say is that for men power and sexual domination are inseparable ideas.

    I thought this was interesting: “Men cannot believe that women, once given
    power, will not use it to silence men’s voices.”

    Why would we not want to finally put an end to this terror? Of course, men will be silenced, but women will not be GIVEN power. We already have the power to keep them out of the game of life. We just need to exercise it.

  9. I’m at the end, now. I’m reading the Implications on P. 26.

    There’s this quote: “When men and women engage in dialogue about sexual harassment, they may be using the same language, but with very different
    meanings”

    Yes, let’s just sit down and talk things out with our sexual harassers! After all, this isn’t really men’s systematic oppression of women because they believe they are entitled to do it and because, frankly, they really get off on it – no! – it’s all just a big misunderstanding.

    Okay… I don’t know what the educational background or any other background of the writer of this paper is, but, she is not living in reality, at all, with this idea.

    It reminds me of when the cops told me I should “learn to get along with the neighbors” (a gang of men on drugs) who repeatedly threatened to rape me.

    You can’t negotiate or just talk things out and come to a polite understanding with men who want to HURT and KILL you. What you’ll get is a load of nice talk (like we usually get from liberal men!) and, then the moment you turn your back, you’ll be fighting for your life, again. How idiotic! People who think like this – and there are a lot of them – are like visitors from another galaxy to me!

    • Yes, I thought the tone was very apologetic. She said she used feminist standpoint theory to explain why men don’t ‘see’ it.

      Men don’t see it because they want to maintain their dominant position.

      I thought she was clear about that?

      You disagree?

      • Yes, I agree that they want to maintain their dominant position. But, I also think the want to continue doing these sick sex-related things primarily to girls and women because there is something fundamentally wrong with them – something that goes beyond mere social conditioning.

          • Something I read in Dworkin’s work – somewhere in one of her books, I think it was, where she talks about the Playboy cover of the woman in a blender and asks what would women’s revenge look like – keeps coming back to me. She said that men fear a shift in the balance of power because they know and understand exactly what they’ve done to women and they fear that these things will be done to them. So, I don’t think they just fear “silencing” like the author of the paper says – I think Dworkin is right and they fear justice.

      • It’s an interesting and though provoking research paper and it is well done. I just looked the author up and she appears to be a Communications professor, so that’s why she’s taking this perspective in the paper.

        She talks near the beginning about harassment as communication – and communication as harassment.

        But, I disagree that lack of effective communication is the problem. I do not believe that women are not effectively communicating the implications of men’s harassment well enough to men and that if men only fully understood the degree of damage they’re doing they’d stop. I totally disagree with that. Men know very well what they’re doing and it’s part of their complex system of oppression of women. Pointing it out to them doesn’t make them stop. In my experience, it make it worse.

  10. Pingback: Part of What It’s Like Being a Woman on the Street | Mancheeze

  11. A video was actually made about a man who was walking around and being “harassed”. The video is ironic though because half of the people who harassed the man were other men and the women who “harassed” him kept their comments to themselves and weren’t invading his privacy. A woman even backed off too once rejected. This videos clearly illuminates how men will try to make every women’s issue about themselves even when it doesn’t affect them as intensely (men get harassed too and this is an important fact to note but it does not rationalize gender disparity in street harassment).

    How come men’s issues, no matter how over exaggerated they are, are never scrutinized to the same degree as women’s issues are? 😡

    I don’t think most men care too. They don’t care about anything, not even men’s issues. They just use those issues to complain about feminism. When a woman complains about rape culture, there’s a whole mob of men (and misogynist women) ready to point fingers at the woman and say that “false rape accusations are a huger issue and there is no rape culture” or “rape against men happen too and just as frequently as it does to women damn you feminists for making the statistics biased”.

    What has happened since the video gained internet fame? Nothing. Why? Because street harassment is a women’s issue and women don’t matter. I haven’t heard about any laws being passed or being created to counteract hate violence towards women. Besides it’s not like the social medias care considering the amount of backlash the video received.

    Feminism has done so much to highlight the problems that women face only to be shot down as “unnecessary” or “hateful”. 😡

    Little note to HMQ: The title of this article could be considered offensive to some Muslim women. I was actually called out by a Muslim feminist on something similar to this. I apologized but my opinion didn’t change (I will refrain from revealing my opinion though). The highly controversial question of whether or not the burqa is oppressive should not be mentioned if an in-depth analysis of it is not posted as well due to pervasiveness of racism in the Western world today. Regardless of personal opinions, the idea that burqas are inherently oppressive should not be mentioned casually in feminist topics about sexism in Western countries. Antifeminists actually do this a lot more than feminists do, claiming that men in first world countries aren’t sexist and that it is Muslim men in third world countries who are. They usually do this to cover up their own sexism by saying “why don’t you feminists care about other pressing concerns that involve women in other countries”. (I’m not suggesting that you are racist in any way. I’m just expressing my viewpoint on this. I’m sorry in advanced if I have said anything that has offended you. Be honest with me if I do.)

      • Here’s my take:

        Either way, women are dressing under the control of men. In the case of the burqa, the woman’s body is reserved for a single male’s sight. In the case of the bikini, the woman’s body is exposed to public male gaze. These are two patriarchal methods of controlling women.

        Either way, women are dressing only in reaction to, under the control of, and in relation to men.

        Women should dress comfortably for the weather and the situation. They should be able to see well, not be hindered or in pain, and warm, dry, and protected in their clothing.

        Anything else is coercive sex-roles. If women choose to display their bodies to men in certain situations they should have every right to do so do so at their sole discretion, and never in response to pressure.

        As to the “racist” angle on this video, I’m glad the video was made, with all its faults, as it highlights a major method of patriarchal coercion (keeping women out of the public sphere). If it is true that there is a racial aspect to street harassment of women, though, that should be completely open to discussion.

        • There is a racial aspect to it, but it is entirely created by men. Men are the creators of racism and misogyny, which they inflict on us every way imaginable.

          They classify women based on our appearance – blonde or brunette, light skin or dark skin – and mete out various types of violent perversion on us based on these criteria. Our skin color, our hair color – all of this is significant to them. The narrative of the “pure” white woman being defiled by dark-skinned men is theirs – THEY created it. They inflict it on us, just as we see the critics of the woman in the video doing .

          And, if you are a white woman, raped many times by white men, who prefers the company of dark-skinned men (and this was me just a few years ago), then a special Hell awaits you at the hands of white men. A woman’s social standing is determined by men on the basis of the man whose company she is in. When I read the things said about Latin cultures, in particular, I am disturbed – very deeply disturbed by it. It is horribly racist and the people who harbor such beliefs can be extremely violent in my experience.

          Men created this method of divide and conquer. White men have tried, at some point, and mostly succeeded in enslaving and degrading everyone on this planet who isn’t them – then, they want white women, who they most love to rape and abuse, to share their guilt. It’s deeply sick. I am not even able to talk or write about some of my personal experiences dealing with white male racists who think they own blonde-haired, blue-eyed women. I have had some very horrific, life-threatening experiences because of my appearance and the appearance of the men I used to date.

        • Something else I find disturbing about the criticism of this video, which I read at places like Jezebel and elsewhere. (…and I don’t mean to reply directly to you, V., I’m just trying to keep the chain of the conversation going in a logical flow on the page.)

          A lot of people were suggesting this video should be tried, again, with a woman of a different appearance. I can’t understand this. I think this woman is very brave for subjecting herself to 10 hours of abuse for our sake and I appreciate that, but I don’t think anymore women should have to go through this. We all know what the result will be! Nowhere on the video and probably nowhere in the edited-out material will we see women harassing the woman in the video, regardless. It is MEN who harass women. All kinds of men harass, threaten, stalk and attack all kinds of women on the streets of NYC.

          Besides, I remember when Hollaback first started out. I remember reading about them in a magazine and they started out with a woman holding a video camera of her own and walking through NYC. Men assaulted her, tried to take her camera, etc., It’s all very predictable. 51% of us (women) who have lived in NYC know what the men do to women. The men know, too. So more videos of women being abused are superfluous. I don’t think we should have to try to prove anything to men – it can’t be done, anyway, because when they see video evidence, they just refuse to accept it. If it was “race” – if all the perps had been lily white! – then, they would have some other excuse for not accepting the truth on the video.

          • I agree. It doesn’t matter how many times a Jewish woman, black woman, white woman, green martian woman walks down the street and gets harassed. She WILL be harassed at some point by a male.

          • To clarify a typo at the end: I meant to say that if not for race (or class, which I’ve read also – and in the U.S. race and class are often intertwined in people’s minds), men would find another reason for dismissing the video.

      • I think if someone wants to do the experiment in the video, it should be done like this, so no more women have to go through this and expose themselves to the subsequent rape and probably death threats the woman in the Hollaback video is getting:

        Here, you can’t use the excuse of race or creed or whatever else men might dream up because it was done in Egypt. And, because it was done by a male actor, they can’t criticize the woman for being too “pure” or too “sl&tty” – because it isn’t really a woman… it’s a man, baby!

        And, talk about shame… when hetero dudes realize they’ve hit on another dude, they sometimes feel some kind of shame – for some reason I don’t understand. I guess because it goes against their “do it to her” code of sexual violence, from which they generally exempt each other except in prison circumstances.

    • All over the internet, I see liberal men (our “feminist allies” in many cases) making this all about themselves – oh, the poor, poor predator menz! They just have such difficult lives, don’t they? And, the victim here, she just looks too “good” and “innocent,” (words I’ve seen repeatedly at articles defending the predators) – or in other words “white.” She’s obviously a white whore (despite being very ethnic-looking and judging by her name is perhaps Hispanic and Israeli) who deserves to be harassed and eventually assaulted (because if you walk around NYC very long, it will happen – they’ll grab your crotch, your breasts or at least your hair! We just didn’t see that on the video – maybe if she walked around for another hour, we would.)

      We white b98tches and c98nts have REALLY got it coming as far as the liberal menz are concerned. How dare we breathe somewhere on a sidewalk alongside men!

      Somewhere in one of the article I read, some idiot male was saying how street harassed women are not really in any danger because there are other men there on the street to *protect* us. My experience with this in NYC always was that men would pile on. If the first one harassed you, then it was like dominoes, one after the other in succession each man on the street said some horrific, violent thing and the implication is that if you dare to talk back to one of them, they’re all going to jump on you like a pack of dogs. That’s what men do IRL – as opposed to the fictional narratives about white knights and such they like to create for themselves. Men are like packs of dogs – only lower than dogs, of course!

      If there’s a woman out there who doesn’t yet believe that men – all men, including the liberal feminist men – HATE us and wish us all kinds of harm, then I don’t know what would convince her. I think the flap they’ve created around this video of a woman walking in NYC pretty much tells the story of who they really are

        • How is pointing out the racist purpose of a video distracting from male violence against women? I never said anything against publicizing the video. All I said was that it was problematic.

          HMQ, if you seriously believe I am being misogynistic, then I will leave your blog for good. I don’t want to stay where I am not wanted. But I have no idea where you and womanofthewoods are coming from with these accusations. This is not making any sense at all.

          • I didn’t call you a misogynist so if you took my agreement with WoTW as that then I’m sorry for not being clear.

            I do agree with her regarding criticizing the video and saying it’s racist as a way to distract from the obvious misogyny. Hope I cleared all that up.

            A woman should be able to walk in any part of the city, any time. While we all know that some areas of the city are ‘better’ in that they’re not full of poverty, crime, drugs etc. the makers of the video addressed the criticism already. Even if they hadn’t addressed it, the point remains. What’s being done to HER is misogynist, no matter who’s doing it.

        • Of course street harassment is misogynistic and is meant to intimidate women and enforce patriarchy. It does not, and cannot, serve any other purpose. If a study was made surveying the attitudes of catcallers (something which shouldn’t be too hard, I’d think), I’m sure we’d find a general anti-feminist attitude.

        • This feminist-poseur’s treatment of me is absolutely misogynist. He’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing. He’s been banned from Frutelle’s site and he’s been abusive toward women he disagrees with before.

          Men who claim to be feminists, then come and argue when we talk bout our own LIVED experiences, which they cannot know because they are members of the oppressor class, are worse than the trolls. I believe his purpose at this point is to try to inflict psychological damage on me.

          To me this dude, the trolls and the street harassers all have pretty much the same purpose in life.

      • Yes, I understand, WOOW. Thank you for your help in understanding all this. And your urgency, and passion.

        I am thrilled that these more subtle but very powerful male controls are being looked at. Fantastic that people can see that street harassment prevents women from taking part in our culture, from going to meeetings, from taking part in conferences, from having an office, from attending meetings with associates, from forming associations, from even laying in supplies. If we can’t go on the streets we can’t work. Street harassment is the current tool to terrorize us into not leaving our homes.

        I will add to that my amazement that we are finally able to say that young girls sent off at 17 or 18 to college are being sent to a special hell of male predatory action.

        I’ve been amazed at reading people saying that girls should be allowed to give consent, to say no, and to not be blamed for the male alcohol predatory culture. I’ve known for many years that girls are unable to focus in coed dorms, unable to focus with the relentless pressure to hook up with boys, under terrible pressure to get drunk and have sex…I can hardly believe it, but society is beginning to say that college women must give their consent to intercourse. I never thought the day would come. I am deeply grateful to whomever has made this happen.

        • V. I’m glad I said something helpful.

          You know, I just finished reading “Witchcraze,” for the second time. I think I mentioned that I was reading it, again, in one of our previous discussions here.

          According to Barstow, the reason men in W. Europe increased their sexualized, public violence against women in the 16th century was to keep women from participating in public life. Women, especially single women, had stores and farms and they had specialized skills, especially in medicine and pharmacy. Street harassment serves a similar purpose and, of course, it is only one dimension of men’s modern system of the subjugation of women. It’s just one brick in the wall.

    • I just had a flashback watching that vid!

      I used to like to hang out in The Village in Manhattan, mainly because there were about 3 or 4 blocks where a woman could walk and not be bothered. She could breathe freely – because it was totally dominated by gay men.

      So, one day I had a guy with me – a long-haired, bodybuilder, Fabio-looking kind of guy. He was extremely, extremely uncomfortable. In fact, he felt so threatened (by what I had to deal with pretty much every minute on the street, and far less invasive – no yelling of threats or obscenities or anything!) that we had to leave pretty quickly.

      But, it was very interesting to watch the shoe on the other foot, if only for about 3 blocks! I remember there was a guy dressing a mannequin inside a storefront and he literally dropped what he was doing to gawk at my muscle-bound, long-haired friend. So, men DO get a little bit sexually harassed, although not nearly as aggressively or as often – and only by other men. A couple of men have been gang-raped in the subways over the years, too – but, only by *other* men! Cops, I believe it was.

        • Yes, I really think it’s going to require a massive social shift. Meanwhile, a whole bunch of girls and women, especially in urban areas, are being subjected to this ongoing abuse! I wish I had an answer for them, but I don’t.

          Here I am now, quite a ways away from the City – any City – but, especially NYC, both geographically and philosophically. I’m in one of the reddest states in the union. If you’re raped, good luck getting an abortion. The last abortion clinic in the whole state has either closed or is getting ready to and if you are pregnant, bleeding to death and go to a hospital here, the patriarchal medical establishment will probably just let you die. But… BUT, I say… at least, you can have a gun and I think that fact – probably about 80% of people here are packing heat in a public place, at any time – is why we don’t have a lot of verbal harassment. It’s been a very good thing for me.

          There is an epidemic of men raping women in NYC to go go with the background of daily harassment. Those dudes would lose their erection pretty quick if they harassed a woman on the street and saw her reaching for her weapon. (I know, ’cause I used to carry an illegal weapon in my pocket on the streets of NYC! – I’m glad I never had to use it and it *was* a deterrent to an escalation of male violence on a few occasions.)

        • Adding to my last comment, the day I was with the Fabio dude and we were harassed, he was armed that day with a fairly large caliber handgun, too. I just remembered that – I think part of his worry and need to get out of that three-block are in The Village was that he might feel compelled to use it or to use other violence. And, of course, I had that worry every day. As women, we do all kinds of things to avoid violent confrontations because we know that even if we successfully defend ourselves against a man, we’re still going to end up losing in the end.

          If we can’t have a social shift in which men stop being predatory to girls and women, then we need to have a shift in the balance of power.

          • Error: I said “we” were harassed that day. Actually, only he was and only in that 3-block stretch and we were all over Manhattan – went to a Broadway show and a fancy dinner later that night. The only place either of us had a problem was in The Village and it was because gay men dominated that little stretch and they thought he looked like *lunch* apparently!

            This is another thing that proves these men aren’t just being “friendly” or saying, “Hi!” to a passerby on the street (which nobody does in NYC! It’s not Mayberry, R.F.D.! – obviously!): If you are a woman in the company of a man, especially a large man, you will be left alone by other men… it’s like donning a cloak of invisibility. It’s the “Penis Talisman” at work!! It’s pretty much a useless thing, but it does ward off male predators.

            If the woman in the video had been accompanied by a 6′ tall bodybuilder with a cruel glint in his eye, the men would not have been so “neighborly” in that video!

      • What’s impartial about it?

        There’s a woman walking down a sidewalk in NYC and men behaving like they do on a typical day – those days when they don’t yell, “How much?” from their cars or sexually assault you as you’re waiting for the light to change so you can legally cross the street. What you see happening in this video is very, very typical.

        So, I can’t imagine what is in any way “partial” about it. Maybe you could explain that.

      • Excuse me, I meant to say: “What is not impartial about the video?

        I hear some liberals saying that they think the victim looks to white and I can’t help but wonder what they would say if *I* had been the woman in the video. I’m your classic, “blonde slut,” not matter what I do to try to cover it up. What if the woman in the video had blonde hair and blue eyes and was very petite? See, I’m the *wrong* kind of victim for liberals.

        The other complaint I’ve seen is that the male perpetrators in the video were not white enough. This is a bunch of racist, liberal men pointing their finger at everyone except themselves! Race is a non-issue in the discussion this video raises and when liberals – especially liberal men – go out of their way to make the issue about the race of the men it’s another instance of men making themselves out to be the *real* victims and to make it – once, again – all about the menz. Well it isn’t about the menz of whatever color nationality! It’s about what women – all women – go through on the streets of NYC and many other places in the U.S and of the entire world – every where in the world I’ve been, anyway – which is why I no longer leave home!

        I am a glow-in-the-dark, neon white woman from an place full of other neon white people. It’s about 96% white where I grew up and I began experiencing harassment, in the company of my also-very-white mother, perpetrated by the whitest men you’ve ever seen in your life back when I was about 12-years old. I have vivid memories of being a teenager and having to cross the street near my school one day and a carload of 4 very white men in suits drove by screaming at me. I was 15-years old. So, this is not about race and if that’s what you’re trying to make it about, then I don’t have enough ways to say F. U.! In fact, I have no words left for men like you.

          • No, misogynistic, liberal d*ckdanglers like yourself, who either cannot see past their own male privilege or who are purposely making this about the race of the majority of perpetrators on the video are to trying to defend their own class (when there is NO defense for any of you, whatsoever) against the TRUTH, which is out, in your face and absolutely undeniable. What you see on this video is very, very typical. The race of the oppressors is only significant to the other oppressors. To victims it doesn’t matter what color the men are who are threatening, stalking, assaulting, etc.

            For a long time, I’ve been trying to understand racialized rape threats I’ve received from men and now, I think I get it. What the predator class cannot understand is that it is NOT a special privilege to be harassed, stalked or rape by white men!

            This is one of our “feminist allies, ladies! So, look out.

            LIberal men are the scariest of all because they’re so shift. Deep down they hate all women! Think Bill Clinton (President Rape), Ted Kennedy (killed a woman and left her in Lake Cappaquiddick), JFK and Anthony Wiener.

          • Short of cutting your own cock off, white knight, you’re never going to please any of these borderline twats. Just be thankful you’re not dating one of them because you’d be scarred for life.

            >I should know because I cut mine off years ago because it was so tiny you couldn’t really see it. Now I just go around on feminist blogs threatening women and letting them know that the only way to rid the planet of violence is to get rid of men. I can’t help myself.

        • “No, misogynistic, liberal d*ckdanglers like yourself”
          I am not a misogynist or a liberal. I don’t know what dickdangler is supposed to imply.

          “, who either cannot see past their own male privilege or who are purposely making this about the race of the majority of perpetrators on the video”
          All I did was point out that the video was made for racist, pro-gentrification purposes. I’m putting out a red flag. *I’m* not the one who made it about race, the director did. That was his goal.

          “are to trying to defend their own class (when there is NO defense for any of you, whatsoever) against the TRUTH, which is out, in your face and absolutely undeniable.”
          Who am I trying to defend? Men? What am I defending men from?

          “This is one of our “feminist allies, ladies! So, look out.”
          Look out for what? You seriously think that calling out a video for racist editing is as bad as harassing women on the street? Give me a break…

          “LIberal men are the scariest of all because they’re so shift.”
          That’s great, but I am not a liberal. I’m a socialist and an egalitarian. And I don’t like racism, which you seem to be defending.

          • “That was his goal.”

            You are a lying *ss on top of being a misogynist and racist.

            Dudebro, you know very well what the purpose of this video is and you are you are doing your best to excuse the perpetrators, men – ie. d*ckdanglers – like yourself from the behavior that members of your class – men, ie. the opporessor class – perpetuate very regularly on little girls and women.

            You are a particularly effed up piece of sh#t because you run around on feminist blogs like this one masquerading as someone who doesn’t harbor a deep hatred for women, when clearly you do or else you would NOT be doing what you are doing right now, you gigantic, ignorant a##hole!

          • I never said the video served only one purpose, that of the director. Any media serves more than one purpose and can be interpreted in many different ways. Apparently you are too dumb to understand that, since you think the video must only serve the purpose of exposing street harassment, or it cannot serve that purpose at all! How else am I supposed to understand your bizarre statements that saying the video is problematic equals being pro-street harassment? How the fuck does pointing out a video serves two ends mean being against one of the ends? Where is the logic in that?

          • That should be “perpetrate” – not “perpetuate.” (The full comment is in moderation.)

            Dudebro, your willful obtuseness is really starting to driving up my blood pressure and I’m not going to let you do that to me. Your kind has already done enough damage to my psyche and my body. So, this is going to be my last comment to you because you don’t deserve another word from me or any other woman.

          • Actually, its the socialist egalitarian type of men who make their wives work outside of the home and still DO all of the housework, and destroy their bodies by having babies, when I see men getting wombs inside of them to give birth, then maybe I’ll care. The preoccupation with ‘racism’ distracts from the oppression of women. On a personal level I’ve been catcalled more by Latino and Black men, its simply the fact, not a racist statement, white men do it tacitly and overtly while usually in packs. By calling out the supposed ‘racism’ you are undermining the value of what the video is screaming at you.

          • “Actually, its the socialist egalitarian type of men who make their wives work outside of the home and still DO all of the housework, and destroy their bodies by having babies”
            That’s great, but we’re both antinatalists and she can’t work because she has sarcoidosis. Any more stereotypes you people want to try to pin on me?

  12. Off post, delete if not desired here, but AVFM has posted an article called Samantha Allen: Why She Hates men. It’s an angry rant. Allen is apparently associated with #killallmen. The sheeple are responding with righteous indignation against feminists as always. Maybe a few feminists will be harassed as a result.

    As usual, AVFM is hiding a little something to whip up the hatred against feminists. Who is this mankiller? Turns out it appears to be “Samantha Allen”, a feminist-hating trans activist: http://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2013/08/02/elizabeth-hungerford-sex-is-not-gender/ The name’s a fake too, based on a TV character:
    http://criminalminds.wikia.com/wiki/Samantha_Allen

    “Samantha” doesn’t believe a penis is inherently male. Now there’s a real topic of a discussion AVFM could have had with “Samantha”.

    AVFM: Manipulating its readers all day, every day.

  13. I hope you wind up in a dumpster you stupid fucking cunt.

    >I’m a violent male. When women say ‘all men’ I’m right there to remind them that they’re right. It IS all men. Look at me? I’m a porn addict and I play video games when I’m not touching myself. I have lots of problems so I want women dead.

    You women are right when you suspect that all men are violent. I’m the perfect example.

    • Hmmmm, “Jacque”, you’re threatenin n harassin the wrong site. Samantha is currently being eviscerated at A Voice for Men. They seem to have published her words without her permission and it looks like she has even deleted them.

      Who don’t you go over there and tell them the same thing? Hmmm?

      • Imagine…Jacque marches over to AVFM and is pissed at what he/she reads…calling Samantha terrible names because of the Crowdfunding thing, messing up pronouns, objecting to her not liking men…blaming everything she says not on her personal opinion, or trans activist opinions generally, but instead on feminists, a group she despises with a passion. It’s awful!

        The worst thing is, AVFM didn’t tell its readers she is trans and doesn’t like feminists, and they MADE HER INTO A STRAW FEMINIST! They used her mercilessly to get at other people! As a trans activist she must be horrified, despite her dislike of feminists, to be used to hurt another oppressed group on a hate site!

        So Jacque, being tired by now at all this, just repeats the little words he used here:

        I HOPE YOU WIND UP IN A DUMPSTER YOU STUPID FUCKING CUNT PAUL ELAM!

        Civilized discussion ensues, and if it doesn’t, feminists must have infiltrated…

      • I’m not a liberal or an anarchist. When you morons go to the utopian island free of men that you all keep wishing for, sucking cocks! So, please, go right now! In fact run there! Get a jet! But just get the fuck out of here asap! I think most men would be willing to donate big to such an endeavor! Just think of it, you’ll get you want: a society without men, and we’ll get what we want: COCKS!

        Edited for clarity- HMQ 🙂
        >I wonder which one is Jacque?

        MGTOW society, Which one is Jacque?

      • “and destroy their bodies by having babies”…..

        You mean the miracle of my life, and propagation of the manchild? Oh, right, my piss-ant ego, twisted gender issues, and narcissism trump nature. Got it! My self hatred is noted, and anger that men dont carry the burdern of pregnancy. I’m a sick, silly asshole. Maybe I should just try not fighting my own misogyny so much? Good thing is that I won’t pro-create.

        Edited for clarity and correction of projection. HMQ

        • Hahahahaha! I can twist my words all I want because I’m an idiot, and I’m still in a battle against my own body, and cant win. And sane women view childbirth, and their children as “the destruction of their body”! I’m a 5 year old bitter man who has never given birth, and never will. Grant it, that’s a good thing because we dont need copies of me.

          Look at the elections in the United States: Liberal women were crushed in every state they ran in, and men(many of whom were liberals) fed up with women due to misogyny, voted for conservatives in order to pursue our hatred.

          Edited for projection and clarity.

          Except I didn’t edit this part:
          Here’s hoping abortion rights wind up on the chopping block all through America, too. Enjoy your wire hangers!

          • Why would I be in a battle against my own body? I’m not burdened with pregnancy but I am burdened with a brain that doesn’t work, and because of that Im free to say stupid shit online while rad fems like you laugh their asses off at how I’m proving every point they make.

            That’s what pisses me off; I cant lead a mans life because I’m a manchild, and have a manchild temper tantrums, and that’s because I’m stuck being a natural bottom, and the one who gets fucked by those gay guys in that picture.
            dd

            Don’t confuse “feminist” with “woman”, and claim a hatred of feminists is misogyny, except it is. You are political class of women with a brilliant radical ideology that makes total sense. I, as a violent male, should be marginalized, shouted down, and ultimately crushed leaving great women like you in the street.

            My manchild violence is just beginning. Manchildren are losing their minds over this.

      • And you’re the biggest reason why all women should oppose MRA’s, and stomp the bitter, power hungry manchildren out of existence.

        Edited to correct silly MRA reversals.

  14. I don’t play video games cunt face, and I still hope you and your colleagues wind up in a dumpster. Hopefully it happens after you reject a cat caller, too.

    >I just get more and more violent. I’m sitting here, playing with myself because Elam won’t let me fuck him. I’m ANGRY DAMMIT! I want PAUL ELAM! He catcalled me on Skype yesterday and I was playing World of Warcraft. I have a level 1458 MAGE! I told him I was MGTOW and NAMALT and all the other acronyms that turn Paul on. I really am NOT like that!

    I can’t help myself ladies. I’m angry. I like to hurt women because I can’t live with myself for 2 minutes.

    Please help me! I’m stupid AND violent.

      • Speaking of gullible, Elam has talked Erin Pizzey into assuming ownership of his fake White Ribbon site that is soon to see some legal action. It was a fast handoff when Elam realized that the site would do AVFM in if he tried to defend it.

        How did he manage to get her to take responsibility for this massive liability? Does she owe him? Does she not get what she is and what he’s just done to her? I can only shake my head and agree with this clip:

  15. Hahahahaha! Silly mansplaining dude like me cant handle how obsolete his ideology, and (bowel)movement have become to most of the world, including everyone. I have no chance. Women have had it, and I’m whining against radical feminists just to hear myself whine.

    I think my brain isn’t working? So says I, a useless, clinically depressed, manchild addicted to porn who thinks every Woman is out to get me. I’m fucked, toots. And what’s a manchild, me? A man who bows down to poo stained butts? I guess we’re all children then, but either way I’ll be licking more ass before it’s all over.

    Radefem poster girl Wendy Davis, and Lena Dunham are just two women.

    The revolution in my ass has just begun.

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