I Saw Something Really Disturbing

I love animals. I watch a ton of nature shows and I adore The Dog Whisperer. I love animals because they’re completely honest and reflect your inner state. You can’t lie to them. I’ve seen plenty of episodes of the Dog Whisperer where men manhandle dogs and can’t figure out why the dog doesn’t trust them. I’ve seen men lie in front of a camera, lie to their family but they can’t lie to the family dog.

An animal, and especially a dog, will read you emotionally. They don’t care about anything else about you. If you’re an asshole they’ll let you know.

In one episode that I hadn’t seen until today, a family with a 4 y/o son decides to do a trial adoption of a small dog. They already have one large Boxer and their son picked out the small dog at the shelter for a 2 week trial period.

I wondered why the young boy picked out the small dog since the family was used to having a large dog. Then it became obvious to me. The young male waited until his parents were doing something else and went to find the dog in the back yard. He taunted the dog and was violent with the dog, kicking it. I was horrified.

I’ve never seen a small child attack a dog and start following it around to kick it. This was yet another example of male violence that was cemented in a male at four years old. The conflict was resolved by him attacking the dog and the dog was small enough for him to do just that.

It just let me know how young socialization happens and how it must be so hard for parents of male children to monitor what they watch and learn since our culture is full of the wrong messages. At FOUR years old this male has already been taught that overpowering and hurting an animal is a solution.

What was also apparent to me is that he only attacked an animal he could attack, meaning he knew which animal he could dominate physically. The family had a cat but the cat would immediately defend itself and the Boxer was just too big. The boy picked the small dog to dominate.

Truthfully, watching this made me sick.

I have a new female baby wild mouse, Babette. She loves Doritos and snuck up on my desk today to get into my cookies. I managed to catch her in the bag of cookies and transferred her to a see thru bag, rubbed her belly and let her go on my bed.

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33 thoughts on “I Saw Something Really Disturbing

  1. Oh. my. god. I couldn’t make it through the whole segment. These people are just so gross. There’s really no other word for it. I had to quit after seeing Jonah kicking the poor dog then going to his mother to say the dog attacked HIM. Oh, isn’t that just like a male to do? Blame the victim?

    I’m not sure what I’m more mad at – Jonah blaming the dog, or his parents siding with their darling little budding sociopath. The mother is just encouraging it by saying “don’t let him pull you, you are the boss.” She’s encouraging dominance, right there, as if males need any more of a reason to be violent abusers. Also, I noticed that the dog was in the cage whining in distress, and they call it “bonding.” Uh, what?

    What I really balked at is when she said “Jonah says he is ready for the responsibility of a dog.” He’s a four year old CHILD. No four year old is “ready” to be responsible for anything. Is she out of her mind? There’s no doubt in my mind since she’s a total cheerleader for male supremacy.

    • I also couldn’t believe they were trying to make a four year old responsible for a dog.

      I will say one thing though. When they were walking w/ the dog the first time it’s true that you have to take a leadership position but saying ‘you’re the boss’ to a male is just horrid.

      I realize that little kids are inept around animals but in this case the male PURPOSELY hid from his parents to go antagonize the dog. He looked around to make sure they weren’t around before he went and kicked the dog.

      To me that shows intention to dominate and abuse. It wasn’t like the dog appeared and the kid was a little rough by accident. It was a purposeful action to go find the dog and abuse it.

      • Oh definitely. The dog clearly didn’t want to be played with, and not only did Jonah knew how to isolate the dog and get it alone, he kept manhandling it when the dog clearly didn’t want to be touched. Then he punished the dog for fighting back by stalking and attacking it repeatedly. You know, just like grown males do when their girlfriend fights back when being assaulted or trying to end the relationship.

        I’m willing to bet in another twenty years, that pasty faced flaxen haired cherub will be facing 15-life for attacking a woman, and his mother will be right beside him in court, dabbing her eyes yelling “How dare you accuse my darling little boy of that, anyone who knows him knows he’d never hurt anyone!” Then, when the evidence gets entered, she’ll then say the victim provoked him. Because he’s her darling wittle boy.

    • Re: “What I really balked at is when she said “Jonah says he is ready for the responsibility of a dog.” He’s a four year old CHILD. ”

      Yes! That really irked me, too. Something is really wrong with these people.

  2. It just let me know how young socialization happens

    You think male violence isn’t innate ? The patriarchy didn’t just drop out of the sky, it reflects the way men are. They put it together because it suits them. If mothers of boys were honest they’d tell you they see the cruelty and violence. Socialisation merely reinforces and rewards their destructiveness and abuse.

    • I studied psychology as a honours student which meant I got to go to seminar level classes reserved for the top students.

      I did a seminar in child development and got to observe a male child, a toddler.

      He wasn’t raised with television or movies. His parents understood that the culture was inherently violent.

      I would observe this child and by far, it showed me that socialization is crucial to how males behave. He was gentle and kind. I saw NO behaviour that was even remotely violent.

      So due to my personal experience and my education I am not convinced it’s innate.

      • I think that on average males could maybe be considered more boisterous, absent negative programming, by virtue of their testosterone. Especially at puberty and onward. I think of testosterone as a “pushy” hormone and, well, given the mechanics of PIV heterosexual coitus, maybe that makes sense to a certain extent.

        But yeah, boys are capable of being gentle. I think this boy you saw on the show is a sociopath, and those symptoms turn up early. I would be curious, too, to see the breakdown between male and female sociopaths as far as what symptoms they exhibit. Do female sociopaths kick animals too, or do they express it in other ways?

      • The thing that bothers me about saying behavior is innate is that it’s an excuse for letting parents and society off the hook. “He was just born bad, that’s all there is to it!” It would seem quite clear from the example above that this boy has been raised in a vicious, dysfunctional family — how else would you expect him to behave? He is doing to the dog what has been done in his family.

        I could not watch the video. When I go to bed at night, I pray for all the animals that are being abused at that moment. I hate my species, so brutal and stupid.

        • You know what’s funny, though? There are SO many women out there, who raise their kids to the best of their ability, and their nigels still turn out to be violent misogynists. Some of them even grow up into teenagers who rape and kill their own family members, likely because they knew their own mother loved them too much to fight back. Nobody talks about that, though. If I had a nickel for every time a mother of a son told me “I’m raising him differently,” well, you know. Besides, any efforts to curb their aggression is to be met with accusations of “feminizing” him and “stifling” his masculinity; because apparently masculinity is synonymous with being a raping, abusing monster.

        • @Meg:

          Every parent says they raised their child to the best of their ability. It is very difficult for women to raise male children alone. I had a friend say to me, “I just don’t understand why my oldest son won’t talk; I talk all the time.” Well, her oldest son wasn’t modeling himself on his mother, he was modeling himself on his father, who spoke little, was homosexual, who married a woman, had four children, and made her feel guilty for “not being attractive enough.”

          Male children need limits, and this is where women seem to have a very difficult time. Every day in every way I see women who won’t set limits for their spouses and their children. What do limits mean? THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR! (Watch woman’s rant about Bruce Jenner, deleted from Facebook, seems to be available on various feminist websites.) I know women are socialized to go along but men are socialized to push women’s limits. I can’t wait around for men to get enlightened, if I am going to have any dealings with them I have to let them know, in no uncertain terms, that I will not accept misbehavior.

          It is NOT love to let one’s children get away with behaving badly.

          • “Male children need limits, and this is where women seem to have a very difficult time.”

            Is this another round of let’s blame all the mothers for socializing their sons wrong, despite all evidence that MEN and male-dominated society actively undermine women’s best efforts? Let’s be real, no matter how many limits a mother can set, they’re still up against the whole of society that repeatedly sends message to your sons that they’re entitled to anything and everything, especially women and girls. Eventually, something’s going to give.

            I refuse to believe in the delusion that mothers can magically change men by simply helicoptering their sons (while simultaneously working three jobs, which is impossible), nor do I believe that mothers deserve to be condemned to live a life of hypervigilance because society refuses to acknowledge it’s pervasive preference towards men and boys.

            Obviously, there are mothers who coddle their nigels and fail to set limits and boundaries. The above video shows that. However, I’m not convinced that all mothers are male-preferential slackers. That’s just another way to scapegoat women for male abuse.

          • Oh, and one more thing – I have a hard time believing that *all* women are so stupid, that they do not know that they are female and would thus be oblivious to teaching their sons some measure of respect for women. After all, they as women would want to be respected by *them.* I am not a mother of a son (thank god) but I imagine had I been cursed with that role, I would have wanted my love reciprocated and that would mean teaching him to see women as people. I also imagine society would have done everything in it’s power to undermine my efforts and have him blame me for “feminizing” him or otherwise stealing away his birthright as a male to oppress women.

      • Exactly this. Two things:

        It’s hardly convincing that testosterone=violence or Xy=violence. There is plenty of evidence to the contrary (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/12/091208132241.htm) Socialization is powerful because our dependence on associations in the process of learning is just immense. Regardless of tendencies, our upbringing is everything and dictates how we express ourselves. We LEARN violence as a reaction to anger or sadness just like many learn self-destruction, crying, withholding, and even laughing.

        Second, it’s really not a pleasant outcome. essentialism, especially concerning male violence becomes an excuse and the age-old “Feminists are trying to repress masculinity” Yes, there are some notable difference between sexes that are well documented, but if you can raise boys and girls the same, I don’t see how you could not have the same outcome.

    • No it’s not. who told you that or put you in charge of what radical feminists believe? That actually appears trollish but I am new to this blog so it’s not my call(Well, not really but recently decided to read and comment)

      Literally every radical feminist academic, writer, and ideologue I know of emphasizes socialization over MRA Biotruth.

      • I am not denying there is socialization but that’s not all it is.

        “1) Evidence such as the need for abortion and other pregnancy preventive methods going as far back as possible into our history point to the fact that men were rapey/violent across all times of known human history. IOW, men have always proven to be a rape threat for women.

        2) Male sexual violence against women is universal, that is, covers the entire globe – there’s no exception, no my-nigel, no far-away land where men are all as sweet as lambs.

        3) there is nobody outside men forcing men to be violent. Their patriarchal system is created and enforced by them alone. no invisible force is secretly pulling the strings behind the scenes. Since it comes from men and not from anyone else, this is the definition of inherent. It’s internal to them.

        4) If patriarchy didn’t suit men in some basic, inherent way, they would rebel against this enforcement, but they don’t, ever. (see also here and here, arguments by FCM in comments). Not that they lack the power to do so, given that they monopolise all political power in patriarchy.”

        https://witchwind.wordpress.com/2013/12/01/more-science-and-essentialism/

        It has nothing to do with me claiming some kind of authority over RFism. That’s a liberal attack against movements being clearly defined and the House Mouse Queen knows I’m not a troll. Also RF essentialism is nothing like MRA misogyny because we do not excuse MVAW.

  3. I don’t know where everyone else is on this, but at this point in my life I don’t even are why men are violent anymore. They just ARE violent, period. Some men are less violent than others, but every man at one time or another, has participated in violence against women. Women can be violent, too, but we don’t gratify violence as a superior expression of our sex, nor does violence seep from our pores and threaten to present itself for petty or egotistical reasons.

    Male violence, on the other hand, is pervasive and ubiquitous. Men wallow in violence, they just love it. They believe that being violence gives them a sense of superiority over women. They watch it on television, in movies, act it out in video games, and every verbal euphemism for righteous bro-hood is marinated in sadistic and violent references, typically sexualized to show their predilection for using their penis as a symbol of violent dominance.

    When men aren’t being violent to women physically or sexually, they’re being violent in other ways. If he isn’t beating you senseless, he’s verbally abusing you for being different than what he wants you to be. If a man isn’t attacking you on the street, he’s catcalling or laughing at you. If he isn’t attacking you in the theater, he’s talking loudly, putting his feet behind your seat, or otherwise making a violent show of himself. On the subway, he’ll manspread to establish his right to occupy as much space as possible, even if there’s a pregnant or elderly woman who needs a seat. If he’s walking in the sidewalk, a man rarely moves out of the way if you are moving in his direction. He expects you to move, and will either plow you over or call you a female specific slur for not going around him. On the Internet, if you aren’t completely submissive and capitulate to his viewpoint, men will stalk you, doxx you, threaten you (and your family and your pets), post your pictures and personal information, they even get their jollies off on egging other psychopaths on to harm you in nightmare scenarios.

    People say “not all men,” and I’m done with all the funfem mental gymnastics where I didn’t want to believe that I am surrounded by violent, sadistic male supremacist bigots who hate women so profoundly, even gay men and cross dressers look down their noses at women as mere plebian mortals with no worth. So yeah, “not all men” but “enough men do” to constitute a social crises for anyone born biologically female. The proof is in how they are consistently and predictably violent toward women at all times, except when women are conforming to their wishes.

    • Certainly by the time they’re grown up and have been thoroughly socialized for eighteen years, it’s usually too late for them to change. When they do manage to change it’s always touch and go.

      • Hi Dana,

        Nice to see a new face around here.

        This video really affected me, deeply, since I am a staunch animal lover and don’t even hurt a wild mouse. I befriend them.

        I watched this video and when I saw how this little boy was being raised and then saw him go after the small dog I sat there with my mouth open for a long time.

        I had an experience while getting my degree in psychology whereby I took a seminar in child development. My assignment was to observe a male toddler.

        This toddler grew up without a television and no access to pop culture, no movies, no nothing.

        He was the most gentle, well-behaved male child I had ever seen.

        Then I see this video of a male child the same age who AT FOUR years old has already embraced gender and is practicing domination and abuse on a small dog.

        I am certainly glad I never had kids. I couldn’t raise a male in this culture. I simply could not. I also couldn’t subject a female child to this culture since I know what it means to grow up female.

        I’m kinda rambling at this point because I’m still so horrified.

        • why do you think we are living in a violent woman-hating patriarchy in the first place if men didn’t fundamentally and innately want that ?

          “I did a psychology course” and ” # Not my Nigel jnr” isn’t a explanation for that.

        • I don’t know how you have the strength to look at any of the stuff online that you critique. The thing I can bear the least is any cruelty toward animals and small human children; if I simply hear of something (seeing it would be too overwhelming), I cannot get it out of my head.

          I, too, am glad I never had kids — we have created a horrific world. From the articles I read over the weekend regarding climate change, our species may not have much longer to poison and devastate the planet. And the planet will recover!

          • Thank you Dogtowner. I’m just like you. I get very disturbed and have nightmares when I see people abusing animals. This video just chilled me to the bone. Four million animals a year are killed by euthanization in the US. I judge societies the way they treat women, animals and children.

            I feel like sharing something personal that’s happening right now. There are several wild fires raging in my area. Where I live the sun is literally blocked out by the smoke. All day yesterday I was breathing in smoke particles. The whole sky is orange/yellow and at 5pm yesterday the sun got blocked and there was this red/orange glow falling everywhere. I’ve been breathing in the smoke for 3 days now. We’re in a heat wave, we’ve had zero rain this Spring and Summer. It’s very frightening because there’s nothing you can do. We’ve had the windows closed so the particles don’t get in everything but they’re so fine they end up everywhere. I’ve had to store all my food in the fridge to keep it away from the smoke.

            This is my first time dealing with wild fires in my life. I would read about them and see films of them but never really understood what the big deal was. Now I know and I can tell you it’s like being invaded by aliens or something. We have no sun today and the sky is orange. There’s a film in the air. Our air quality is so bad the govt. has issues warnings to stay indoors and close the windows. Nobody can do that though because it’s so damn hot. What a nightmare.

  4. Is it a bit risky to talk about “innate” male behavior? Why should male behavior be innate and female behavior not be innate? And being an old-time radical feminist, I never once heard any feminist say that male violence was predetermined by genetics back in the day. If the society we live in is a foregone conclusion, then what is the point in fighting its brutality?

    • Who is this in response to? As far as I know, and HMQ can correct me if I’m wrong, she’s already made it clear she’s in the opinion of socialization being the problem.

      • Read the above comments, Meg, to see who says male behavior is innate. I am not blaming mothers for sons’ obnoxious behavior, that is a simplistic way of looking at what I said. I do not believe that male children raised in loving, compassionate homes turn out to be serial rapists. I had two boys in my home NOT raised in loving, compassionate homes (one with an incestuous mother, the other with extremely self-absorbed parents who religiously abused him) who certainly did not turn out to be serial rapists or violent in any other way, so a home that produces a serial rapist has to be pretty extreme.

        As far as teaching respect for women, I have met few women who are respectful of women. Women are taught to compete with one another; I have even seen lesbians competing with straight women for men’s attention, which is very sad.

        • Dogtowner, is there any particular reason you decided to put your comment way down here, instead of in reply to whoever you are taking issue with? Had you posted it under whoever you are taking issue with, I wouldn’t have had to ask.

          Also, you say you are a radical feminist. I guess anyone can claim to be anything on the Internet, but for some reason I’m still willing to give people the benefit of the doubt. Your comment, though, seems to point to an anger at women that I don’t usually see in feminist circles. So, I’m having a hard time figuring out what end result you’re trying to produce from commenting here. You say feminism isn’t about male behavior being biologically innate, but then I can also say that blaming mothers – even in a round about way – isn’t what feminism is about either. No, my response to you is not simplistic, it’s just following *your* thought to it’s eventual conclusion. You can’t say you weren’t going down that road, because that’s exactly where you were headed.

          And no, it is not true that homes that are compassionate do not produce serial rapists. Everyone knows that many male criminals are raised in stable, peaceful homes with no abuse, yet they continue to rape and murder women as long as they can get away with it. Gee, I wonder why that is? And it never fails that each and every time, the response is the same, mothers wiping away tears saying “My little nigel could never do that. We’re a normal family.” And right she is – something goes wrong in even the most typical of households, and most radical feminists understand why.

          Also, women having a measure of respect for women isn’t a zero sum game; it’s a logical deduction I already explained above. You’re saying that competitiveness between women drowns out any rational self-interest a woman may have to assert her own humanity. How, then, do you explain GOP women who stopped the 20-week abortion ban, at least temporarily? How do you explain why women still hang out with each other, commiserate with each each other about men, and even managed to form feminism itself if we are such horrible people who are competitive? For someone who claims to be a feminist, you are incredibly pessimistic about women in general.

          Lastly, the fact that I feel compelled to type all this, and the fact that you refuse to be up front with people here and speak directly to whoever you feel is wrong, sends my troll radar off. These are things I don’t have to explain to even mainstream feminists, so yeah, I’m suspicious at this point.

        • Re: “I do not believe that male children raised in loving, compassionate homes turn out to be serial rapists.”

          I hate to be the one to break it to you, but you are seriously deluded. Men from all kinds of backgrounds rape serially.

          It is possible that innate male violence can be mitigated by means of socialization – which, as far as I understand it is the HMQ’s position. I get this idea from having read loads of her posts and watching a whole bunch of her videos for the last couple of years.

          But, rapists don’t rape because of poor socialization at the hands of their parents or society – they rape because it is their nature to do so. The majority of rapists are serial rapists – they are not unusual members of society. In fact, they are your sons, your father, your step-father, the “nice” married guy next door, your boss, your co-worker, your preacher, etc.

          Males cannot be taught to respect women. The only time they appear to have any respect at all is if that woman has got a loaded weapon aimed between their eyeballs. They only appear to respect her for a second then because they are selfishly thinking about their own mortality.

          Respect for other people is something you either have or you don’t and they don’t. It’s like the ability to have empathy or compassion – these things cannot be taught, either. But, men and boys do learn how to be good actors, especially around their mothers and women they want to put their dicks into.

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